New to Salt. Need advice!

[ReefGrief]

I am very new to the salt thing (have kept African Cichlids before) and would welcome all opinions from those who have been there, and done that! So far, all I have is a dry tank so I have a ways to go before getting to enjoy all things marine. I have been researching pumps and skimmers quite a bit as I try to narrow down my choices (WetWebMedia has been a wealth of information). I am trying to do this as cheaply as possible so keep that in mind as well:

Tank: 72 gallon bow front - 48 x 18 x 22, one overflow rated for 600 gph, Durso standpipe with 1" bulkhead out of tank, 3/4" back in.

Sump: I can only fit a 24" x 12" tank in here (a 20 gallon). I will be separating into three compartments separated by baffles. Compartment 1: Skimmer and heaters, #2: refugium with LR, #3 submersible pump connected to 3/4" PVC pipe ( check valve and gate valve here, and 2 90 degree elbows to get it back through bulkhead, then I have a Y fitting with two flexible directional nozzles out to tank. Do I need a section of pipe going from pump back to refugium with gate valve? I have seen this done but don't know why??

Pump: Eheim 1262: (this I don't have yet so I welcome opinions). Rated for 792 gph at 4' head. Since my overflow is only rated for 600 gph I figure I need to try to get as close to this as possible to reduce sucking sounds? I figure I might lose 50-100 gph due to elbows and T's so this should work?? I need a pump that is very quiet (living room) and energy efficient and relatively cheap. This one is $190 at J & L. This pump has a 3/4" output which is what I need.

Skimmer: Not too sure yet. Thinking of maybe Aqua C Urchin Pro (rated for 60-120g) with Mag 350 pump ($300 @ J&L), or EuroReef CS5-2 (75g) $389 or CS5-3 (90g) $419. Ideas?

Lights: 48" Coralife Aqualite Lunar Lite 4 - 65w, 2 3/4watt LED Lunar lights, with 2 10,000K, and 2 Actinic. $330 at Petland. I know this isn't great, but I plan on only keeping soft corals and a few low light LPS.

One more question, I don't plan on buying an RO/DI anytime soon. Can I get away with using Saskatoon tap water? I have a buddy who owns a car wash and I could fill some barrels with RO water from there if that would be better? It would be a little more inconvenient of course, but if it would give less troublesome algae, maybe its worth the effort?

I welcome all comments, please help!:confused:

[scary gary]

Sounds like you been doing a lot of reserch. Every thing sounds good. Can' t understand why you would need a return back into refugume. I don't own either skimmers but you want to go with the biggest capacity. Try to go with the best lighting you can afford. I know you said softies and low light hards, but that's what we all say in the begining and end up upgrading. Don't know about Saskatoon water, but I've been usingR egina water for 9 years and have had no more problems than anybody else.

[Rentaltux]

Welcome! I am also from Saskatoon. As far as skimmers go both mentioned are good skimmers. I prefer the Euroreef. I have a CS 6-3 and love it. It is really easy to operate. I would go Euroreef and as large as you can afford. I don't think you should skimp on skimmers. I wouldn't use tap water, this is asking for problems down the road. Use RO or RODI water. Get as much liverock as you can afford. This will help with filtration. Good luck! Look me up if you have any problems or questions. When you tank is up and running I know where you can get awsome fish and corals here in town.

R

[Joe Bee]

Welcome to the site. The list of equipment you have chosen are all quality products. You may want to try a Squid device on your return. I have one on my 29 gallon and I know of a few other members who are happy with theirs. It adds needed alternating current (not AC):crazy: without the heat issues of internal powerheads. Are you going with a bare bottom or a deep sand bed?I have sand beds in my tanks (one with a plenum & one without). Some prefer the bare bottom to ease in cleanup. What you will notice is that there is no right or wrong way to maintain a beautiful reef tank other than to be patient and educate yourself. Good luck

[Invigor]

For the price of tap water versus ro/di water, I'm a cheap bugger and use tap water. I have brown glass on the back of my tank because of it, but it doesn't bother me. If you can get ro water outta your buddy for free, go nuts! get a 250gal tank for your truck and haul water, lol.

I believe the split part in the return back to the refuge is if you have a 900gph pump and a 600gph overflow, you can open it up more to the refuge so less water goes to the return to avoid putting any backpressure on the pump. I believe the durso is designed to eliminate the slurping noise from underflowing your overflow.

On a 4 ft tank you could almost get away with a single MH in the middle. if you don't want to go with halides, that's perfectly fine and the PC should suit you well enough. just with a MH, you won't ever have anything left to upgrade to. or if you're a do it yourself kinda guy, you can get a 4x48" t5 fluorescent setup for around $250 which will give you ample light, much more than 220w of pc light, either way will be good.

The nice thing about this hobby is there aren't usually right and wrong ways of doing things, there's broad area of "it works for me".

Sounds like you're on the right track with everything tho.

lastly, when looking for a return pump, pay attention to it's power consumption, there are alot of power hogs out there, and if you do your studying you can probably save 5-10 bucks a month on power consumption with just your pump.

[scary gary]

Just wondering what problems are going to develop down the road from useing tap water. I hear this all the time and have had no more and maybe less problems with algae's (hair, slime) than people that use r.o. water. I had fantastic corraline growth till my urchin cleaned it all up. 1st year was a problem but 8 years after have been great. Reef tank has been up for a year and had no problems with anything. Corals don't seem to mind tap water. I know a majority of the people use r.o. Another of the many difficult decisions.

[Bayside Corals]

Hi and Welcome!

I to am from Saskatoon, If you ever need any advice let me know, Rentaltux and I could surely help you out!

As others have already mentioned you seem to have done alot of reading which is great! Your system seems like it will work out perfectly. If I were you I would go with the biggest Euro-reef that you can afford. I have seen Rentaltux's in action and I can say that it's an awesome skimmer! You would not be dissaopinted if you went with a Euro-reef. It may also make your life a little easier in the long run as far as algea goes.

I know you can get away without using RO water but I would definatley use it if you have access to it!

Like Invigor and Scary said, I would consider going with lighting with a little more power. That way you will be able to keep more corals with out having to worry if they are getting enough light or not.

Before you purchase your live rock let me know. I know of a great place to get it from!:icon_wink

Colby
________
Zx14 vs hayabusa (http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Which_bike_is_quicker_kawasaki_zx_-14_or_suzuki_hayabusa)

[Rentaltux]

There are people who have had success without RO water. I just feel that it gives you a little added insurance against algae issues. Not to say you won't have algae with RO but it should help. Once algae takes hold it is a PITA to get rid of!

R

[ReefGrief]

Thanks for the comments everyone! For the record, I'm handy, but not a guy! :) I thank you all for your comments on the skimmer selection. I think I will go with Euroreef, since it gets so many great reviews. As for the lighting, I am still not sure what to do. I don't want a huge power bill every month (who does), and my tank is in the living room so the fixture I choose has to look "nice". The Coralife fixture is 260 watts ( I don't know how many lumens) which is 3.6 watts per gallon. I admit I don't know alot about lighting yet, but I just got my copy of "The Conscientious Marine Aquarist" today so I have alot of reading to do! I would like to get some water in my tank some day. Do you think I can get my other components and live rock in to cure without any lighting? It would be great to break up the expense a little. Or, do I need lights on to cure the rock? I guess maybe I could make a canopy and then do a DIY fixture inside it? Decisions, decisions!! Thanks for your help so far!

[Rentaltux]

People may argue this but I don't feel you need lights for curing & cycling your tank at least not at first. As for lights have you considered VHO's? I have 4 x 110 watt VHO's and my softies & LPS are thriving. I may even try some SPS. I have seen some nice VHO SPS tanks.

R

[Invigor]

do yourself a favor and get rock that's already cured. curing smells about as nice as taking 10 year old ukranian easter eggs smashing them up into the carpet in your living room and letting the afternoon sun shine on it all afternoon.

I made my own canopy, and I admit it's not perfect, but it does the job and doesn't soak up water. I put in some fans to keep the MH cool otherwise they say it'll get about 125 degrees celcius under there, which I can't imagine anything good coming out of. Depending on what kind of bulb it is. a single 250w MH bulb will cost around $8 of electricity a month if it's on for 8 hours a day, 30 days a month, which you'll find it costs more than that to heat a tank your size. I just found a scrap piece of aluminum and bent it up to mount my bulbs on and voila. good and cheap and does a fine job.

[Bob Roberts]

People may argue this but I don't feel you need lights for curing & cycling your tank at least not at first. As for lights have you considered VHO's? I have 4 x 110 watt VHO's and my softies & LPS are thriving. I may even try some SPS. I have seen some nice VHO SPS tanks.

R

What is the bulb life on those VHOs? I have read some less than stellar reviews as to short bulb life and the savings on power, vs. MH, are more than off set by the much higher bulb replacement costs over time. Just wondering about your take on them.

[Invigor]

understandablly, it's cheaper to run a 250w MH than it is to run 4 110w vhos.. and you can get 2 really nice MH bulbs for the price of 4 vhos.

Don't think a MH will quite make the 4' stretch tho.

[d.serko]

Welcome to the insanity, I mean hobby. I second what everyone is saying about skimmers, you will really like the euroreef. As to lighting my advice is if you could wait a bit save up and go with metal halide's to start you will really save yourself some money down the road upgrading. trust me, I thought I would only be keeping some low light corals but when you really get into it you will want mh lighting and clams and sps corals. When you do get going shoot me an email if you need any help. I can also donate you a fiji yellow leather frag and some mushrooms if you would like. although as I have been nuking with kalk paste mushrooms that are spreading all over the last few days I don't know if I would put them in a reef again.
Also definately go with RO water at the least, your tank will look alot better without the nuisance algae.

Hey Rental Tux are you still up for the swap of the yellow leather frag for some gsp's? If so let me know. Also if you are ever driving #16 past Radisson and want to stop and see the tank just let me know.

[Rentaltux]

What is the bulb life on those VHOs? I have read some less than stellar reviews as to short bulb life and the savings on power, vs. MH, are more than off set by the much higher bulb replacement costs over time. Just wondering about your take on them.

I changed mine after about 9 months but the only reason I did was to narrow down the causes of an algae bloom. It wasn't the lights. I think that you should get at least 12-15 months. Some people say the run theirs for 2 years with no probs. I will have to wait and see. I like the VHO's for the actinics. I think that 2 - 250 MH or even 2 - 175's would cost more to run than 4 VHO's especially if you supplement with PC's or VHO's as most people do that i have seen. I agree you can keep more high light corals but if planned right you can keep quite abit with VHO and not as much heat issues either. Don't get me wrong I like MH just not in my house. I can keep enough corals to keep me busy and without the added expense.

R